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Kitchen layout?
bearebeare
December 28, 2012 in Design Dilemma
What would be the best layout for this space
Was thinking of having island run parallel to window and in line with a cabinet on right side of door with fridge and stove along left side wall side by side with pantry
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designideas4me
I like the island idea. Look up info on the kitchen work triangle and keep that in mind. maybe even mask off the space if put something there that resembles an island so you can move around and see how it feels. Think about the minimum space needed to function between refrig and oven and sink and all those practical considerations. I have a long L shape and there isnt much I can do to get more counter space next to the frig so I lengthened the island but now it gives me less room to open refrig door. You can get a free kitchen layout and design at home depot or lowes.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 12:53AM
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thislittlehouse
This might sound drastic, but if you can move the door you can have pantry, cabinetry and stove, then the fridge (where the door is in the photo) all along that wall with the window, and then the island bench can be opposite the window with the sink in it.

We've doing this in our kitchen redo and we love the layout! It works so well having everything within a few steps. Check out my blog : www.thislittlehouse.com.au

Can you show more pics? What's happening on the other sides of the room?

:) Elise
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 12:56AM
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PRO
Dytecture
I agree with more views of the kitchen and also a scaled floor plan should have been drawn and designed prior to demolition. Are you planning to keep the rounded peninsula by the door ? If so that would get in the way of having an island.
2 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 6:48AM
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PRO
A Kitchen That Works LLC
For safety and ergonomics, allocate at least 42" between the edge of the potential island countertop and the edge Of the perimeter countertops. With this as a starting point, layout your components (sink, fridge, etc,) and you can develop different scenarios. How do plan on purchasing cabinetry?
1 Like   December 28, 2012 at 6:57AM
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lulamarie
To save money, try not to move plumbing if possible. Here's a plan that I think will work for you:

Staring at the current wall with the stove from left to right:
first thing - from the corner, continue the hallway wall about 34"-36" into the kitchen area so that you can add a light switch to turn on your kitchen lights. this will also make your cabinetry/appliances look built-in

here's my suggested order:
floor to ceiling pantry with double door, probably 2 separate sections
refrigerator with cabinet above
counterspace with shelf above for glasses and a closed cabinet above that
oven with microwave above
counterspace

For the sink wall, from left to right:
counterspace
sink
counterspace with dishwasher underneath (measure though - not exactly sure if it'll fit with the door there)

get rid of the peninsula thing and add an island. i can't really tell which direction the island should sit with respect to the room. but, my first thought is that it should run parallel to the current stove wall. you could have stools on the opposite side.

look at the after photo here for an example of this suggested layout: http://www.houzz.com/discussions/281189/Kitchen-Remodel



please share measurements of the kitchen footprint.
1 Like   December 28, 2012 at 7:10AM
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bearebeare
This what we were thinking
The micro wave / oven would end in line with edge of island
Is this ok?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 2:41PM
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designideas4me
wow that door is in an odd spot. Have you thought of moving it?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 3:00PM
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designideas4me
On a positive note, if you have a fire you have a quick escape...lol
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 3:02PM
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lulamarie
Questions:
1. Is that a microwave and an oven to the right of the door or a double oven?
2. What is to the right of the double oven? Is there about 3' and then the room ends?
3. Are you replacing all your cabinets or refacing the ones you have shown in the "before" picture?
4. If I was sitting at your island, is there a wall behind me or does it open to another room?
5. Where does the door lead?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 3:31PM
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PRO
A Kitchen That Works LLC
Can you provide a floor plan? From the perspectives, the island appears out of proportion to the room but maybe that is just the perspective. The distance between the ovens and a safe landing spot appears too great for general safety.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 4:25PM
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rpl814
Hi, my floor plan might work for you. I have the island going in the other direction. I don't know if that wall is down from where you're taking pictures. I took mine down. Just a suggestion and it isn't done yet, so this is an in process pic. Good luck! I struggled over the same thing for months.
1 Like   December 28, 2012 at 5:01PM
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bearebeare
Lulamarie
1-it is a microwave/oven
2-to the right is our dining room
3-yes I am replacing all cabinets
4-there is no wall at your back it is completely open to living room
5-the door goes to a deck we would like to get rid of it down the road and add more cabinets in its place but we need to extend the deck first to have a French door in the dinning room (right side of wall oven/microwave)
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 5:23PM
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bearebeare
Sorry this is a very rough scetch but it gives the idea of what is where
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 5:27PM
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lulamarie
super helpful! thank you.
can you tell me the length of both kitchen walls?
if you installed french doors in the dining room, would they go just behind the short-end of the dining room table?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 5:35PM
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lulamarie
@rpl814 - you kitchen is beautiful! question: do you plan to use a microwave? if so, where will it go? is it in the island?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 5:41PM
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bearebeare
Yes the French would go behind short end of table but there is also a French door along the long end as well to a different covered deck
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 5:42PM
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PRO
LM Designers
I would really like to see you get this professionally laid out. You can get it done for free at Home Depot or Lowes along with some great advice. There are rules that the designers go by and it is hard to tell with these drawings and no dimensions if it works. Ask the designer how long they have been designing to make sure you get an experienced one.
1 Like   December 28, 2012 at 5:45PM
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rpl814
lulamarie our microwave is a drawer (sharp brand) and it's located in our island. Let me know if you'd like more pictures. A hood is going over the range top.
1 Like   December 28, 2012 at 5:46PM
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lulamarie
@bearebeare - Honestly, I'd go ahead and have the backdoor removed, the wall framed up, and add drywall since you're having to add drywall anyway. A good carpenter can wall the door frame in no time. That way you can go ahead and add the cabinets during the install too. Try to keep the window centered between the cabinets if that makes sense.

I was trying to figure out if there would be a way to add a door in your dining room that would lead to your driveway or garage (for bringing in groceries). If you add a set of french doors to the short end of the dining room table, keep in mind how they swing open - will the door get in the way of the chair for example? You don't have to answer that, it's just something to consider.

I think your layout is smart based on the sketch you provided. Since ovens aren't used on a daily basis, I don't really care where it goes. But, if you use a microwave often, I find it most useful to locate it near the fridge but it's not that big a deal. I'm not a fan of microwaves in the island because it requires bending over. Maybe rpl814 will share what a microwave drawer as I'm not familiar with them.

You've probably done this a thousand times already in preparing your design, but really think through how you operate in a kitchen. Think through how you unload groceries, how you grab a glass and pour something to drink (coffee, wine, water, soda), how you warm-up leftovers, how you make your coffee, how you grab items from the fridge, prep, cook and clean. Ideally, you only want to take a maximum of 3-4 steps to do a task.

Visually, there are two things I don't love (but neither are dealbreakers)
1. The island looks a little heavy. I think because it's designed not to have an overhang, which is completely fine and probably more stable, but it overtakes the space a bit.

2. The last upper cabinet down the wall with the stove is on a diagonal. I am not a fan of those cabinets. And if you're serious about installing a cabinet on the right side of the sink, I'd try to make them as symmetrical looking as possible.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 6:26PM
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lulamarie
@rpl814 - sure, more photos! do you have one of what the fridge looks like inside?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 6:32PM
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rpl814
Here is the microwave drawer.
The fridge is a full fridge and full freezer. It's very big but we had the space so figured why not.
1 Like   December 28, 2012 at 6:36PM
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lulamarie
@rpl814 - very cool, thanks for sharing. questions:
1. where will you store your drinking glasses?
2. is the cabinet to the left of the sink a diagonal style? or is it flush to the wall?
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 6:57PM
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rpl814
The glasses will go in one of the upper cabinets. There are 5 of them and they're all the same size. The bottom corner one is one of those lazy Susan cabinets. I'm not sure if that's what you were asking about.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 7:12PM
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lulamarie
I meant the upper cabinet to the left of the window - sorry. That can be a tricky spot so I was curious if your upper cabinet there was turned on a bit of a diagonal.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 7:19PM
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rpl814
They are flush to the wall. There's actually wasted space where the two meet (an empty triangle). I think we did that because a corner cabinet wouldn't have looked like the same size. They're all the same because the glass tops looked better the same size.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 7:22PM
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lulamarie
Right. I agree that it looks better but is functionally a bit odd.

@bearebeare - i just thought of something. i can't tell from your mockups, but if possible, see if your pantry can have a greater depth so that's it's flush with your refrigerator. do you see in @rpl814's photo that his fridge and his pantry cabinets are roughly the same depth and then once it returns to normal size cabinetry, it goes back a bit? check the depth of your intended refrigerator. it doesn't have to be exactly flush, but this buys you a deeper pantry and helps prevent the fridge from "sticking out." helpful hint - the low profile refrigerators are much more costly.

also, you'll have to sacrifice some of the upper cabinet space above the stove to accommodate the vent that carries the smoke exhaust outside.
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 7:37PM
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bearebeare
Sorry this took so long but here are the measurement of kitchen
So the wall with the window is
Total 181"
35 5/16 from corner to window
64 6/16 window opening (no trim)
14 10/16 from window to door
33 12/16 door opening (no trim)
32 8/16 door to dining room space

The stove wall total 166"
48 12/16 From corner to stove
This is blank and outlets can be moved anywhere on this wall

Pluming for sink is under window bug can be moved as we have to do dishwasher anyway and have family of plumbers
:)
0 Likes   December 28, 2012 at 10:58PM
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Sue Ann Stevens
Love your fridge and layout seems great. Pay attention to standard kitchen work triangle measurements and always think about landing spaces for fridge/oven.

I would have to second the suggestion to remove the door now while everything else is being framed and constructed.

It is also extremely to have your kitchen layout planned out to the inch before any construction begins. We had an issue of an upstairs drain that could not be moved when removing a wall which lost us 5 inches. Amazing how that messed up all of our cabinet placement along one wall when, in the process of correcting I found out that there was no such thing as a "stock cabinet" bank of drawers 20" wide which is what i intended to purchase. Take nothing for granted. :-)

When we reno'd kitchen I kept 50" spacing where cabinet doors from island and other side both opened up. I also purchased hinges that allowed for complete opening instead of 110 degrees like standard hidden hinges. Lifesaver--it's all in the details.
0 Likes   December 29, 2012 at 6:06AM
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lulamarie
Yep, you've got the island turned the right way. I think your layout works quite well. Having the sink under the window is perfect! Keep the dishwasher to the right of the sink for loading/unloading ease, (since you have to stand beside the dishwasher to load and unload). Make sure you have enough space between the island and the dishwasher so that when you can open the dishwasher the whole way.

As for outlets - think through how many appliances you use and where you'll use them - coffee maker, toaster over, mixer, etc. Don't forget a switch for the light over the sink and a garbage disposal. You'll want separate lighting over the island and outlets there too. If you have the money, splurge for undercabinet lighting and your kitchen will have a warm glow at night (be careful with some LED lights though as they put off a harsh/cold light).

The A/C heating vent can go be positioned within the toekick (warming your toes in the winter...or your dog if you have one...will love to lay there). See the first photo I shared above (it's located to the left of the sink just above the floor).

The counterspace between the stove and the sink will get the most use when cooking. You'll likely grab your items from fridge/pantry, wash at sink, and then prep food to the right of the stove for cooking. You want plenty of space for cooking there (ie. don't put a ton of countertop appliances there).

If you add the cabinet where the door is, I'd make that a coffee/baking station/area. In one cabinet, I'd store mugs/coffee/tea/sugar, etc. And in the other, I'd store mixing bowls, flour, sugar (or display the dry goods in functional but pretty glass jars on the countertop).

Not sure how you're designing the other side of the island? It's a good place to store potatoes/onions/breads and also a smart place for a rollout or tip out trash can and recycling bin.

You want to store your glasses either near the dishwasher/sink or by the fridge. You may consider using some glass panels in a few of your cabinets to light up the look around the sink. Again, that's personal preference. But if I had this kitchen, I'd store my drinking glasses in the cabinet to the left of the sink, plates too.

Danville Remodel
Glascock Remodel
11th Street Residence
Park Slope Brownstone
0 Likes   December 29, 2012 at 8:08AM
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remove123
RPL can you tell me the brand of your refrigerator?
0 Likes   December 29, 2012 at 8:10PM
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Grace Reed
I agree with LM Designers. Are you working with a kitchen designer?
0 Likes   December 29, 2012 at 8:40PM
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rpl814
It's fridgidaire counter depth fridge and freezer. Very reasonably priced compared to the high ends with the same look. Fyi It measures about 66" wide.
0 Likes   December 29, 2012 at 9:19PM
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rpl814
It's fridgidaire counter depth fridge and freezer. Very reasonably priced compared to the high ends with the same look. Fyi It measures about 66" wide.
0 Likes   December 29, 2012 at 9:19PM
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remove123
That is a brilliant idea with the side by side fridge and freezer. Are there any downsides to that approach compared to a standard fridge? I imagine that water on the door isn't an option. But it sounds like a nice idea to have that much space at your fingertips rather than having a second fridge/freezer in the garage as so many do...this seems to be one spot that would hold everything!
0 Likes   December 31, 2012 at 6:00AM
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