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Cabinet questions?
911roxie
February 8, 2013 in Design Dilemma
In a small u shape kitchen does adding an angled lazy susan to each corner make a room feel smaller. Should I just leave them a straight corner?

Also plan of installing simple cream shaker cabinets. These are 8 ceilings what size cabinet 36" with 6" molding or 39" with a 3" molding would look the best?

Thank you in advise for all you help and suggestions
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PRO
Main Line Kitchen Design
6 inches of stacked molding looks better and gives you play if your ceiling is not level. It also costs less. This one is a no brainer in my opinion.

Making the corner 45 degrees has advantages and disadvantages:

On the plus side:
It won't make the room seem smaller like you worried.
The doors function simply instead of folding which can sometimes be problematic.
The corner by the peninsula will look better
On the Negative side:
Between the range and dishwasher will be a little funny looking and less functional.
The opening to the cabinets is almost 3 inches smaller so getting bigger things in is a problem.
If you are OK lacking symmetry (I am) do the Easy Reach Super Susan in the range corner and the diagonal lazy susan in the other.

If you are open to more change:

I would never get 24" wide doors in a design, like on the left side of your fridge. I would get an asymmetrical 36x33 Easy Reach in the dishwasher range corner and add a 9" tray base to that side next to the range, and shrink the base and wall cabinet next to the refrigerator to 18". This looks better and functions better. Now you can have a corner wall cabinet in the corner and an 18 " wide door on both sides of the range.

If you are buying a new refrigerator get a French door or a large single door refrigerator with the freezer top or bottom. A side by side is a pain against a wall, and it's hard to get into the refrigerator. (I guess you've noticed this).

Best of luck
Paul
2 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 2:31PM
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PRO
Scott Design, Inc.
What is the construction of your new cabinets? Frameless or inset? If inset, how wide are the rails and stiles? What is the vertical drop of the crown molding offered with your cabinets?
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 2:38PM
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911roxie
Thank you, for great the information, expecially about the cabinet opening beiing 3" smaller by the stove-dishwasher. And I'm sure the ceiling is not level so I will do the 36" and find some photos of molding ideas.
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 2:42PM
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911roxie
Plan on Framelss. vertical I looked at a 4 1/4 if I went with the 39" - could use the extra storage but with a simple shaker I'm afraid it will be long and boring. The 36" I'm not sure what molding to do there. I've been looking on houzz and the photos are so hard to tell ceiling height and some look so square or boxie looking.
1 Like   February 8, 2013 at 2:46PM
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PRO
Interiors International, Inc.
OK, Paul at Main Line Kitchen Design rocks! He gave you some very valuable advice. If I could add to it would be to check out the "www.rev-a-shelf.com" website. They have some great storage ideas.
2 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 2:49PM
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PRO
Curb Appeal Renovations
I'll throw a kink into this...why are you going to use a stacked crown on shaker cabinets? IMO on a shaker cabinet you should use a straight crown, definitely not a stacked. See the first picture. On the 2nd picture, it is a simple crown, not stacked.

Something you need to consider, whatever the crown is on your cabinets, we typically run that around the rest of the room. A stacked crown, might be heavy in a room that has 8' ceilings and would be expensive.
3 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 3:01PM
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PRO
Scott Design, Inc.
I agree with the 36" height. I would not go any larger than a molding with a 3 1/2" drop (prefer a large COVE molding, now a bellied crown which is too colonial). If you can't get a 3 1/2" vertical drop molding but something less, then get an additional 3/8"-1/2" half round molding to put under it. Your initial concern is valid. The 4 1/2" drop is too big for the shaker style but you don't want a wide band above the door and the molding that looks out of proportion to the other cabinet details. That's where the half round comes in positioned about an 1" below the top molding.
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 3:02PM
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PRO
Main Line Kitchen Design
Rev-a-shelf is great. With Frameless by the way, never use a 24" wide door they will sag over time. I'm not a frameless fan, especially if you have small children. Since the hinges are attached to particle board or plywood instead of solid wood they can pull out of the cabinets if put under duress and are next to impossible to repair. Poorly made framed cabinetry is bad too. Here is a blog on the topic:
http://www.mainlinekitchendesign.com/general/let-the-cabinet-buyer-beware/
1 Like   February 8, 2013 at 3:09PM
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PRO
Main Line Kitchen Design
Also for a cream kitchen the molding can be done in unfinished wood and color matched to the cabinets. Any paint store can scan a door and color match to near perfection. Especially if you are running it around the room it will look better without field seams (cabinet moldings come usually in 8 foot lengths, while unfinished molding will come in 16 foot lengths). Having a seam along a crown run over 8 feet will look bad. Unfinished molding is 20% the price and it can be caulked to the ceiling and the seams caulked and painted and touched up last to give you a more durable finish that won't open as the wood expands and contracts. I agree a cove crown will look best with a shaker door.
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 3:22PM
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lisanne74
I have the same kitchen ..
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 3:52PM
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PRO
JMH Designs
I agree with Main Line Kitchens completely. I would just like to add and ask are you going for the Arts and Craft feel with your shaker doors or are you looking to the clean, crisp feel that is associated with the Nantucket feel that is extremely popular right now? If it is the latter then you might want to consider a three piece crown that has a flat stock in the middle which still allows you a little floating room if your ceilings are out a bit. I attached a drawing that shows this. Sorry it is not an actual picture the kitchen is still in the planning stages. Note though the cost is a little more but it really does look sharp.
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 6:44PM
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Jean Tuck
I love the layout and even the colors, easy clean kitchen flooring, cupboard between fridge and stove is wise so when cooking it doesnt cause fridge to run more tokeep things cool andrun up your hydro bill, a glass door on both cupboards either side of sink would be pretty and only if I changed colors of cupboards I would paint out a soft cream for spacious look leaving wood trim to reflect wood colors in table. Just silly me I guess.I might even tweetthe decor with apple designed window topper or stawberry some thing to tye into the red wall. Might even make my own tablecloth in same material .Its a well designed space for any gal to work with.In future the only cosmetic thing you would freshenup your room woul be your paint and curtain till you marble counters need replacing. Well designed. as this counter is inducive to many color changes.
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 7:00PM
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PRO
Curb Appeal Renovations
I stand by saying 6" would be too much of a crown. If you're getting the crown for the cabinets, I realize getting it finished by your cabinet company is more expensive, but chances of finding exact same crown profile can be tricky...so why not get the exact same profile and finish?

Also, not all cabinets are made the same. Need to check the warranty on the cabinets. And frankly, how many cabinets will hold up to kids swinging on the doors?!
1 Like   February 8, 2013 at 7:26PM
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PRO
Interiors International, Inc.
I was just looking at a cabinet that I thought had a large crown. It is 31/2" and it looks large enough. 6" crown around a ceiling is fine but on top of a cabinet it seems a bit excessive.
2 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 7:33PM
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onthefence
I agree with the two prior comments - a 6" crown seems like it would be overwhelming. Especially on a style as clean and simple as Shaker.
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 7:39PM
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PRO
Scott Design, Inc.
It's not a 6" crown. It's a 6" soffit area with either a 2 3/4" drop cove with a panel molding underneath or a 3 1/2" cove molding without a panel molding. Refer to the sketches below
0 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 8:43PM
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gielliott
I like the Nantucket trim detail by JMH Designs. My only comment is go for as many drawer bases as you can afford. Wide drawer bases are so much more functional. I am on my fifth kitchen and the prior one I did wide deep drawer bases and loved them. It is so much easier to pull a drawer out and look down and see everything right away. Even the pull out drawers you can option that are behind doors are more troublesome, especially when you are busy. I know drawer bases are more spendy than door bases, but when you factor in the expense of pull out drawers option, I think it is pretty much comparable.
2 Likes   February 8, 2013 at 9:11PM
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PRO
Main Line Kitchen Design
Thanks Scott and JML for making the crown detail understandable. It is not 6" of crown, it is 2 1/2 to 3 1/2" of crown depending on the style and mostly flat stock to make adjusting to the ceiling's level issues possible and unnoticeable. Even the crown could be nothing more than another piece of flat stock, or an angled piece if you wanted the cabinetry simpler and more modern.

But for a shaker cream kitchen I would prefer either Scott or JML's crown detail. Use Scott's if you want the kitchen more modern and JML's for more traditional. With framed inset doors JML's is almost the rule, with frameless Scott's will go better. With full overlay framed cabinets, either is classic. If you want the kitchen to still be here, and function 40 years from now there is only one choice to make and that is a well made framed cabinet.
0 Likes   February 9, 2013 at 5:06AM
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PRO
Curb Appeal Renovations
Well we can argue about the crown til we are all blue in the face, that's personal preference. Personally, if I was doing this for a client, I'd never build a sofit. Even googling shaker cabinets brings up cabinets with crowns like the one I pictured above. But again, it's your kitchen, we are just giving our opinions!
0 Likes   February 9, 2013 at 6:05AM
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PRO
Main Line Kitchen Design
Curb appeal- The ceiling is 96" not 108 like your picture. If Roxie used 36 inch cabinets and a 3 inch crown she would create a 3" space on top of the cabinets that couldn't be cleaned, was a health hazard, and looked silly. If she used 39" cabinets and no filler with a full overlay shaker door, then when the wall cabinets were hung level it would be obvious how off the ceiling was, and again look bad. Sorry to disagree with you but it really isn't a matter of opinion, in this case.
0 Likes   February 9, 2013 at 10:12AM
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PRO
Curb Appeal Renovations
No ceiling is ever even. Ever. That's why you always leave a reveal at the top. Nor is a wall ever perfectly level. Or a floor. That's construction. And why a good trim carpenter does wonders. If it is that bad take the drywall off and fix the issue.
0 Likes   February 9, 2013 at 11:34AM
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911roxie
You all are great for taking the time to give me advise. I am going for a clean look. The height of the cabinet and molding was a trouble spot and the cabinet company just wanted me to do the 39" with the 3"+ molding. JMH, the photo is great!!!!. I think it is what this room needs. Scott Design and Main Line really helpful info. As for the comment about the drawers - I agree however I am locked in with lay out and size. I'll post photos when its complete. Give it a couple of months - can't wait. Thanks a lot to all!!!
0 Likes   February 9, 2013 at 2:46PM
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